Affected files:
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/BONUS - COVID-19 and the End Times.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E1 - Who Are the Prophecy Pros.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E10 - Billy Hallowell Media, Prophecy, and Journalism.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E12 - Amir Tsarfati Israel, World Deception, and The Day Approaching.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E13 - Dr. Tony Evans A Crisis of Leadership and Hope in Prophecy.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E2 - The Relevancy of Bible Prophecy.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E3 - Hollywood’s Obsession with the Apocalypse.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E4 - Phil Cooke – Prophecy, Culture and Hollywood.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E5 - Rapture – God’s Special Ops Extraction.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E6 - What Happens at the Rapture.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E7 - What’s the Big Deal with Israel.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E8 - Dillon Burroughs – Purpose of a Watchman.md
Podcasts/Prophecy Pros/Season 1/S1E9 - Are we living in the days of Noah.md
![[S1E12 - Amir Tsarfati Israel, World Deception, and The Day Approaching.mp3]]
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Jeff: Welcome to the Prophecy Pros podcast. I’m Jeff Kinley along with Todd Hampson and our special guest today is Amir Tsarfati and Amir is from Israel, of course, and he’s a native Israeli and a former major in the Israeli Defense Forces. He’s the founder and president of Behold Israel, which is a nonprofit ministry that provides access to news and information about Israel from a biblical and prophetic standpoint.
Jeff: He is married and he has four children and resides in Northern Israel and he’s also the author of a brand new book called The Day Approaching: An Israeli’s Message of Warning and Hope for the Last Days, published by Harvest House Publishers and Amir joins us today from Israel. Amir, thank you so much for being on the Prophecy Pros podcast.
Amir: Oh, thank you. It’s my pleasure and I hope that it will bless many.
Jeff: Amen. Well, let’s jump into it.
Jeff: Amir we’re introducing hopefully your ministry to a lot of people who, even though your ministry is global worldwide, literally hundreds of thousands of people following you and hearing your weekly prophecy updates and that sort of thing but in case some of our listeners hadn’t heard about you before we thought maybe we’d start by if you could just briefly share how you came to Christ and then we’ll start there.
Amir: Yeah, I’ll gladly do that. Well, I grew up in foster care since my parents divorced when I was very young. I was just three years old. Growing up in foster care was not the best thing ever and at some point at the age of 17, having no hope in my life, I thought this is not for me and I wanted literally to kill myself. I planned it carefully and just before I did that by consuming tons of pills, something stopped me. I mean, I know today who it was, but then I didn’t and I decided to give the world one last chance.
Amir: That time I studied for my high school exams, I went to visit a friend of mine to do study with him in his house and while I was in his house the parents and their children before lunch were holding hands and bowing down their heads and they prayed without any prayer book or anything, and they talk to God as if he’s their best friend. They even-
Jeff: Wow.
Amir: …used the personal attributes, such as thanking God for me for being there. I mean, nothing was scriptural or… scripted excuse me. Anyway, I lost my appetite. I didn’t understand what’s going on. I started asking million questions and along the next few days, when I started going over to that friend again and again, I decided it’s time to ask the million dollar question. Why do you pray in the name of Jesus, B’shem Yeshua every prayer. They told me everything, but I couldn’t really understand that. They asked me to just ask God. To ask God to show me who Jesus is and so I did and the following morning after I prayed, I went to work before school as I did, since I’m 12 and I put together the different parts of the morning newspaper, and there it was. A huge one page size advertisement for the Jesus film of Campus Crusade for Christ showing in Jerusalem for two days following the day after I prayed.
Amir: I mean, I couldn’t believe that God is answering prayers that fast and in such a high quality. I mean, we’re talking about a movie that was thrown for me speaking in Hebrew with great cast. The backdrop of the movie… because the movie was filmed in Israel. I recognized everything. Some of the cast was Israeli cast, and so everything was amazing. I understood the gospel. I understood how it fits all the words of the prophets because I was very connected to the Jewish prophets breathing the Old Testament. I had no idea about the New Testament.
Amir: I accepted Jesus that night. Came back home, told everyone in my foster family that they’re sinners and they must be saved. One day you’re a sinner, the next day you accuse everyone else for being… and then after a few weeks, when they saw that it’s not a teenage craziness, it’s actually a serious threat, they kicked me out of the house. I moved to live with my friends who led me to the Lord. I got baptized three days before my military service began and I joined Israeli Army. From someone who didn’t even like the basic training and wanted to run away from the military, I ended up being summoned to the officer’s academy completing the very, very difficult officer’s course in Israel in the middle of the desert.
Amir: Just when the Gulf War started, I was sent to Jericho. Within few months became the deputy governor of Jericho and few months later I was brought to the inner circle of this secret, the state secret that Israel began negotiating with the Palestinians on full withdrawal from Jericho. When I left the military, I studied in the Hebrew University to become an Israeli licensed tour guide. I led tours and after getting married we moved to Germany to serve there in a different capacity, which I’m not at liberty to talk on.
Amir: We came back, I studied school of ministry in Costa Mesa, California. Came back again and started Behold Israel originally right after 9/11. I was in New York, 9/11. I mean, believe it or not. I saw the… last evening that fell on those two buildings. After that of course the Lord started opening so many doors to teach, but Behold Israel was registered as a nonprofit in the U.S. only about 2014, I think and that’s it.
Jeff: Wow.
Amir: We’ve got four children. We live in Northern Israel, right opposite the valley of Armageddon. I get to see it every morning.
Jeff: Wow.
Amir: Yeah.
Jeff: What amazing testimony in terms of how you came to the Lord but also it is abundantly clear that just the Lord has had his hand on you every step of the way, preparing you for what you’re doing now and I’m really glad you shared all that Amir, because that really gives a lot of context. If some of our listeners haven’t heard of you before, that gives a lot of context. It lends a lot of credibility. [inaudible] a lot of the other questions we’re going to ask you about Bible prophecy and what we’re seeing in our day and that sort of thing and that kind of brings us to the first question. The elephant in the room is about COVID-19. There’s so much confusion around that. In households, in America and every country, everything from it’s not even a disease to the whole gamut.
Jeff: Recently you had a prophecy update where you talked about the two extreme views and then kind of the middle of the road view and just the importance of believers having discernment but all of that as a lead up to ask you this one question, what do you make of COVID-19? How it relates to Bible prophecy and how we should as believers use the sermon to kind of filter what we hear and how we respond to what’s going on in the world.
Amir: Yeah, well, I’ve been teaching for the longest time on the attempt of a global elite to basically create a new world order and a one world government and that attempt started in the book of Genesis already. I always like to go back there because it’s all back in Genesis. It’s all in Genesis. We cannot attribute that only to the 21st century, and they’ve tried everything. They’ve tried world wars, they tried climate change. They’ve tried different financial crisis and different other things, but nothing ever, ever was so well planned and well executed as COVID-19.
Amir: You don’t have to be a rocket scientist to go back just about three years ago and see that the warnings by those people were already sounded, that within a few years a surprise pandemic is going to take place. Now, I never heard of a surprise pandemic that can be predicted three years earlier and we’ve seen a great, great effort in the last few months prior to the outbreak to start pushing the idea of vaccination for an immediate threat of a pandemic. Now let’s face it. If they claim this is something that came from the wet market in Wuhan, how in the world could they have known that pandemic is about to break up? I mean, there’s no way you could know that.
Amir: However, if you know where that virus is going to come from, if you know when that virus is going to be released, and if you know how it is going to behave, that is good enough information for you to start sounding the alarm months and even years before because you’re in full control of everything and that is exactly what happened. By the way this is not a conspiracy theory, that the United States administration agrees that the Wuhan lab is the source of the virus. That China was well aware that there is a virus that is lethal and that the virus can spread from human to human and that it is super contagious and China knew about it. I mean, it seems like anyone who collaborated behind the scenes with China in the labs was well aware of everything.
Amir: The people who were not well aware are the good and the simple people that don’t seek to destroy and to control and to gain from all of these things, and the world was taken by surprise and by the way, from the very get going, I remember I knew that the main aim of the virus is to hit America eventually and to somehow bring down the American economy. Look, if there is one thing that President Trump could wave at the face of the Democrats in running for a re-election, it was the economy. Let’s face it. The economy did great. The unemployment was in its lowest numbers ever. It was a miracle.
Amir: I mean, thinking about what he received from President Obama and what he made it within just less than three years, it was nothing short a miracle and the blessing of God, the good hand of God. I cannot disconnect it from that because President Trump from day one understood the value of prayer, the value of faith based movements to take a very big role in its administration and all of that.
Amir: Now, what is the best way to destroy the economy of the United States is to not shoot a single gunshot and to somehow create an atmosphere where the whole world is affected thus America is not different than any other country, and you cannot blame anyone for what you’re going through because everybody shared the same misery and pain. This is brilliant if you really think about it. Just like China just said a few days ago, if America will blame us for COVID-19, we will blame America for the Spanish flu. I mean, it’s something that you cannot really put your finger on and blame someone and ask for some sort of compensation or anything.
Amir: Now, the spiritual aspect of it is even more important because as I said, it is a global effort for a global control of a small group of people that is using people who love themselves and money. Let’s face it. The people behind the scenes, the very few families, they don’t lack money. They have more than you can ever imagine, but they lack the control that they wish to have. They’re operating like puppets. People that want money, love money, wish for more money and would love to be part of all of that, and these are the politicians and these are the officials in the different government departments and that’s the sad thing that we see today.
Amir: The deadly combination of very corrupt government officials and corrupt politicians joining hands in taking advantage of this pandemic and pushing forward and pushing through their liberal agenda and their… look if I’m not mistaken, there was a mayor in the U.S. that just literally used… I’m not sure if it’s a mayor or a governor. She used the word new world order. That’s what she said. She said, we are in a new world order and that’s where we are. The Bible predicted that at the very end people will be lovers of money. People will… and all of that is under this guise of we take care of you. We want you to be healthy. We wanted to do well. We’re protecting you.
Jeff: [crosstalk] in safety, yeah.
Amir: Exactly. It’s fascinating to see that. Look, we couldn’t stop it. Could you? We couldn’t stop it. There’s so many things in this world that are going to be evil, that we know they will happen but we cannot stop it. God, through his word already told us it is going to happen. I mean, let’s face it. None of us will ever stop the antichrist from showing up.
Jeff: That’s right.
Amir: I mean, you can try but it won’t work, and so none of us will not be able to stop the opening of the seals and the blowing of the trumpets and the bowls and all of that. These things are going to happen because God knows what men are going to do or say, or even think and so we as believers, we’re exposed to a classified information of what the future is going to be. People pay a lot of money to know what’s going to happen. We don’t need to, we just need to flip the pages, get to the book of Revelation and enjoy a revelation that was given to John 19, almost 2000 years ago.
Amir: John himself had no idea in many cases how accurate and amazing the things that he has been exposed to, to people that will live almost 2000 years later and here we are. We are the people. We are the generation like no other generation that is watching these things, that is seeing these things, that is experiencing these things. I’m thinking about biblical scholars that had to write about Israel 110 years ago, 120 years ago. They needed a lot of faith to say Israel will be back at their land because we were all scattered in more than a hundred different countries.
Amir: Most of the Jews never planned on going back to Israel and Israel was a desert wasteland and so you needed a lot of faith, but the Bible said we will be back and here we are in the 21st century, we’re already back. 72 years ago, we established our state and we are the generation that can see the fig tree blooming, and so there’s so much that our generation has been blessed by and to whom much is given, as you all know, much is required.
Jeff: That’s so true Amir. I appreciate that perspective and you’ve just recently written about a lot of this in your new book, The Day Approaching. Why don’t you just take a minute and tell us, how does your book address some of these issues that we’re beginning to see. Just these converging prophecies and the way that the world really is coming together like little tributaries into this river of God’s prophecy. Tell us how your book addresses some of that.
Amir: Well, my book is… As an Israeli believer, I like to look at things from the perspective of how things look like from Israel and I look at the prophecy of Daniel regarding the timing of things to happen. I look at the prophecy of Ezekiel regarding establishment of the state of Israel, the return of the Jews back to their land and what’s next when it comes to the war that is around the corner. I’m also looking at the reality of the Jewish people and the church. The apostasy of the church, as in 2 Thessalonians chapter two, that is already going on how the world is getting ready with a mystery of lawlessness that is already at work.
Amir: I don’t believe we are to see the antichrist but we already see the preparation for the antichrist. We already see the apostasy that has to come before even his rise and I was tackling that. I was talking about the fact that we are having the restrainer within us, the Holy Spirit. I talk about what the restrainer is all about. When will the restrainer be removed, why the restrainer is removed. I talk about what happens when we get to heaven. I look at that perspective also, the bema seat of Christ for the believers from corruptible to incorruptible and of course I’m talking about the millennial kingdom, which is something that the church is divided on because… it really saddens me that we as believers choose portions of the Bible that we should take seriously and portions of the Bibles that we should not take seriously. Portion of the Bible we should take literally and others we shouldn’t.
Amir: The mere fact that Israel is back in the land to me is a great testimony to how God is not only accurate in the timing of things, but in the manner of how he’s doing things.
Jeff: Absolutely.
Amir: I don’t understand how come you find no problem for a nation to resurrect after 2000 years, but you find a problem for Jesus to return and reign from Jerusalem for a thousand years.
Jeff: Right.
Todd: I was going to say, if you believe Genesis 1:1, the rest of the Bible’s not that hard to believe.
Amir: Exactly. Exactly, but you know what? I believe that many of them will give you maybe even a different take on Genesis. Once you remove the whole story of the downfall of man, you will also have to remove the need for atonement and the need for sacrifice and all of that.
Jeff: Absolutely.
Amir: When you don’t teach a six days creation and the fall of man, why would you try to lead anyone to Christ? I mean, if there is no need for a sacrifice. They always choose the things they’re more comfortable with and that is of course because they were brain washed by science. If science can not in their opinion prove a six days creation, then of course, science will never support a return to earth of Jesus with millions of his believers in a body that is not even humanlike like we have today and reigning over humans that still have the human body.
Amir: Everything doesn’t make sense, but you know what? If that doesn’t make sense to you, then don’t even get close to the book of Revelation because every chapter there will not make sense to you.
Todd: Yeah. Jeff and I often talk about the importance of one of the… for both of us, the importance of Bible prophecy, the fact of fulfilled Bible prophecy. That track record is why we can believe all the other crazy stuff because even though we haven’t seen the return or the events of Revelation, we can look to God’s track record of fulfilling Bible prophecy.
Amir: Absolutely.
Todd: …in credence to his word, which is right and has a batting average of a thousand, and that’s kind of what we’re trying to convey to our listeners is… and a lot of them are first time prophecy students and actually because of the COVID-19 stuff and everything being shut down and churches doing more things online. Personally, I’ve been hearing from more and more people, probably more than I have in the past six years, that are awakening to the truth of Bible prophecy for the very first time. Amir, we are wondering if you’ve seen kind of some of that same phenomena, like the church at large still seems largely asleep, but it seems like there’s a whole new generation of believers and these are this audience we’re trying to reach that are finally kind of opening their eyes to Bible prophecy and looking at the world through that grid. Are you noticing kind of same thing?
Amir: I do notice that, but I must say that I’m not impressed by… Let me explain what I’m saying. I was in New York the day before 9/11. In that morning of 9/11, I was in New Jersey doing a devotional for a large church just on the other side of the river and of course I remember the aftermath of 9/11. I remember that the churches were packed and I remember that I actually had to stay, I couldn’t fly back home. I had to stay 10 more days and I traveled from one church to another and churches were just packed with thousands of people and people were parked outside and listening through loudspeakers outside and people bought the DVDs and the tapes. At that time there were still tapes, believe it or not.
Amir: It was amazing and the number of people that every time we gave [inaudible] or called. The number of people that came forward was unbelievable but here we are. I can’t imagine, but we’re almost 20 years after that and let’s face it, the effect of 9/11 has dwindled a little bit and maybe even three years, four years later when you have a 9/11 and then short… I don’t know. Six years later, you vote for a Barack Hussein Obama as your president, then I’m not sure what was going on through the mind of most Americans at the time but I do know one thing, genuine conversion, genuine faith in Christ can only be measured in the longer run. I do see now more or less what I saw then a greater interest in the Bible. A greater interest in understanding the times and the seasons.
Amir: My prayer is that it won’t fade away as fast as the 9/11 did because let’s face it. This is not the judgment of God, but it’s definitely, if God allowed it, it’s the warning of God and what a shame it will be. Look, I am reminded of the two witnesses. I’m just preparing a message under two witnesses right now, [inaudible] my mind. The two witnesses… I mean, imagine to yourself the power that God gave them and all the great, terrible things that they are exposing regarding the antichrist and they are confronting him, the beast with… or anyone who is not following God with the truth of the word of God. You would think that these people are going to create a massive return to the Lord of the whole world but if anything, people took pleasure in seeing them dead and dragged in the streets, and yes, when they were resurrected, there was a move of God among the people, but it didn’t last too long. It didn’t last too long then.
Amir: Then the second part of the tribulation begins and we know the end of the story. Again, I’m just saying, my prayer is that we will do what we need to do, which is giving the people the word of God and the promises that God has for the believers and of course, let God do the rest. I can only tell you that I feel bad for those that will continue to reject him now because COVID-19 is nothing, compares to what the world is going to go through.
Todd: Amen.
Jeff: That’s right. Yeah. The post rapture chaos and crisis is going to hit is… like you said earlier, is going to create an environment out of which the man of sin can rise up and bring that peace and safety and that type of thing. You’re right. I mean, I love the way you described that. This really is sort of just… almost like a preview trailer of what’s to come in the spirit of what’s going to eventually happen in the world. A lot of people right now Amir, are the question. A lot of young Christians are asking the question, hey, I know that God loves me, but this is happening in my world and there’s been preachers talking about messages on peace and anxiety and how to handle all this but I don’t hear a lot of people talking about God’s sovereignty and just how it kind of relates to his love for us.
Jeff: I guess the question would be, if you’re a young believer you’re thinking to yourself, I know God loves me, but why is he allowing all this calamity to happen in my world right now? What would you say to someone who is kind of wondering about how God’s going to work all this stuff out for them?
Amir: First of all, I would say that Jesus never promised us a garden of roses. From day one before he left he said, in this world you will have tribulations. He did not sell us illusions. We live in a fallen world with fallen… We are fallen creatures, but we’re surrounded by demons and demonic activity and there is the mystery of lawlessness that is just at work from Genesis 3 already. We see all of that all around us and Jesus said to the father, father, I don’t… then, 2000 years ago. I’m not asking you to take them, but I ask you to keep them out of the evil and so… Look, we need to remember that God, A, is in full control. That, B, sometimes suffering brings some great things in our saved life and a great appreciation to God and God’s word and also we have to understand that as long as we live in such a fallen world, we cannot expect the greatest things of all.
Amir: Now, this is why Colossians in chapter three is very, very clear about where we as believers need to set our minds on. What to set our mind on and it says, if you indeed were raised with Christ, if you are a true believer, if you have been born again, then he says to the people then seek those things which are above. He says, and not the things on the earth. For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God and when Christ is in our life appears, then you also will appear with him in glory. Look, until then we need to seek those things which are above and this is why it’s important that we teach people that beyond what we see around us, there is the promise of the rapture and the promise of the bema seat and the promise of the marriage supper of the lamb, and the promise of returning with Jesus to reign and rule with him and judge with him, and the promise of the new Jerusalem.
Amir: There are wonderful promises for the children of God that we need to focus on and not only on the bad things that are a direct consequence of the fallen state of man and of this world.
Todd: Wow.
Jeff: Amen.
Todd: That’s actually a perfect lead into my next question. As we talk about Bible prophecy, we always try to guide the end of our conversation. We have a few more questions, but we try to guide it towards what hope do the believers have and everything you just hit on. All those things that get our mind off and our focus off of the world and onto our promised future, give us hope. In that regard, as we see the shadows of the tribulation being cast, I mean more than we ever have before, number one, what does this tell us about the proximity of the rapture and how should that affect how Christians live today in this very moment?
Amir: Yeah. Well, I always like to use this analogy. When you see middle November Christmas lights, you know that Thanksgiving is around the corner. When you see the signs of the rise of the antichrist, you know the rapture’s around the corner, because it has to come before. There are no signs for the rapture. This is the cool thing. The rapture is going to be, boom, we’re snatched away. No one knows the day, no one knows the hour. What we do know, we do know what the world is going to go through and we do know what’s going to happen in the world and this is why Paul wrote to the Thessalonians regarding our gathering to be with the Lord.
Amir: You have to understand the world is going to grow through things. The world will have to see first great apostasy. The world will have an antichrist that is going to rise. There will be an horrific demonic oppression. People will reject the love of the truth that can save them and they will therefore receive or be given to strong delusions but then he says, look, but you have to understand this antichrist that is going to come and the people that are going to follow him, all of that can not happen until after the restrainer is gone, and so we see the restraining power of the Holy Spirit on all of these things.
Amir: Look, let’s face it, look at what the two witnesses are going to do in this world, and I’m talking about the people of God. I’m not even talking about the bad people. The antichrist and all of his people. I’m talking about two witnesses. God is giving them power to stop the rain and to cast fire. You’re talking about things that we don’t see today, but that’s the thing.
Jeff: That’s right. Yeah.
Amir: Right now we are in the realm where the restrainer restraints and he not only restrains the supernatural but also restrains the Lord from judging the people right now. It’s not yet the time. It’s not yet the time and then of course, once the restrainer is removed, then God will judge and it will be supernatural.
Todd: Amen. Amir, you mentioned earlier, you live across from the valley of Armageddon and I can’t even begin to imagine how spectacular that must be. Napoleon called that the world’s most natural battlefield, but as you get up every morning and you look across the valley of Armageddon, what does that do for you as a person who is committed to helping the church prepare for the raptures as… preparing the world for the end times, that type of thing. What does it do to your perspective, your sense of immanency, urgency, passion, as you visually are able to see the place where God’s going to fulfill Bible prophecy in Revelation 19, what does that do for you?
Amir: Yeah. Revelation 16:16 speaks of, of course, the gathering place and I always tell people it’s not going to be a war in Armageddon, it’s going to be a gathering place. The war will take place in Jerusalem as Zachariah promised, and God will judge the nations there in the valley of Jehosaphat but the gathering place is showing me that the world is determined to come together only for one purpose, is to defy God and God’s word and to ridicule the people of God and that’s what is going on even now.
Amir: I mean, when was the last time planet earth stopped and all nations were dancing to one rhythm. When? I think the last time it happened is the Tower of Babel. I cannot think of even a single time where the whole world was in the same situation. Look, even in World War I and World War II, one part of the world fought while other part of the world didn’t. South America, I’m sorry, wasn’t part of World War I, World War II. Brazil wasn’t part of it. Mexico wasn’t part… but here, I mean 190 countries were affected by this.
Amir: I can see that the agenda of coming together and definitely not to worship God but to replace God, that’s what I see when I look at the valley, because let’s face it, they’re all gathering together and they would like to fight God in a way, and then they run all the way to the center of the universe, the city of Jerusalem and Jesus will come and he is riding a horse, not with a branch or… an olive branch in his mouth. It’s a sword that is coming.
Jeff: That’s right.
Amir: …and he’s determined. A lot of people don’t like that part of Jesus. I mean-
Jeff: That’s right.
Amir: …they don’t like the part that he’s coming to judge. They don’t like the part that he’s coming as a political leader and a military leader. They don’t like the part that it’s a sword that comes out of his mouth and not an olive branch. They prefer him on the cross turning the other cheek and forgiving for everything. Well, they missed a train. He did come for that and the second coming is not for that, and so I am looking at the valley and I’m thinking to myself how amazing it is for me to know the plans and to know the enemy’s plans, not just the plans of God.
Amir: Look, every intelligence organization of any country on planet earth, wish they knew what we know. Let’s face it, they would pay a lot of money, but they don’t take us or whatever we say seriously, because it’s the Bible. Because they ridicule the Bible because they don’t think it’s a real thing. They’ll take words of their analysts better than what we say and let’s face it, we are way more accurate than any analyst.
Jeff: That’s right.
Amir: …and that’s what I feel. I feel like there is great deception. There’s a great power struggle and eventually God will say the last word.
Todd: That is-
Jeff: Amen.
Todd: That is so true and so well put, Amir. I mean, it’s… Jeff and I talk about how it’s like putting on infrared goggles when you study Bible prophecy and believe, take God at his word. You see the world in a whole new light and that makes it sometimes difficult for those of us who are studying Bible prophecy and watching world events because I almost feel like we have to back up what we say 10 times more than anybody else with facts, because it comes across as conspiracy or whatever.
Amir: I know.
Todd: We know that God’s word is true. We put our faith and trust in that as watchmen and as students and teachers.
Amir: Let’s face it, there is conspiracy. The conspiracy is to replace God.
Todd: That’s right.
Jeff: That’s right.
Amir: It’s an ancient old conspiracy. We don’t have to. If there is one thing I wish to convey, when my book was written, the idea was, and you can very see it even on the cover. You see a fig tree blooming when everything else is dry and it’s because we as believers, we live in the days when we see the fig tree blooming. The people of Israel. Look, tomorrow is the 72nd anniversary to the recognition of Israel as a sovereign state by Present Truman and it’s also the second anniversary to the recognition of President Trump in Jerusalem as our capital. This is a historic day. We’re talking about-
Jeff: Nice.
Amir: …unbelievable things. Look, we are the generation that can see the fig tree blooming.
Jeff: That’s right.
Amir: …and the Bible says that that generation shall not pass away and that’s why I name it, The Day Approaching even though the Bible says, and so much more as we see. Not pray for, hope for, but we see with our very eyes the day approaching.
Todd: Amen. Hebrews 10:25 says it all.
Jeff: That’s right.
Todd: And that’s a great lead in to kind of our last question. We joked at the beginning before we started recording that this was going to be a three hour conversation because it literally could be, because we can just keep going, but we want to make sure that you have… before we kind of wrap this up just for time purposes, what’s on your heart right now. Like what’s the one thing… I want to make sure we didn’t end this call without you… in this interview without you talking about the one thing on your heart, the one thing that you most want to impress on listeners right now?
Amir: I sense a great deal of weariness and anxiety. People are falling into deception from all sides because they tend to fill their minds and hearts with videos rather than the Bible and they watch and they watch things and they share things and then they watch things and they share things. I get probably the same video forwarded to me by probably 500 to 600 people every day.
Todd: We thought we were the only ones.
Amir: And I’m sure that you know exactly which videos I’m talking about because they’re the same that are circulating. We have to discern because many times the makers of these movies, they have a different agenda and many times it’s a bait and switch, which means we want to give you good things now. We’re going to gain your trust and then we’ll put something else later on, and so we have to understand that everything we watch and everything we listen to, it has to be in addition to the Bible and not instead of the Bible. To me, it feels like people have switched the Bible with YouTube. They’ve switched the Bible with Facebook and instead of reading the Bible, they read what people write about Bible.
Todd: That’s right.
Amir: …and we end up with biblical illiteracy that leads to deception and leads to division, and that’s what the enemy wants. The enemy wants to sow division and deception and if we can’t attack them from the outside, let’s attack them from the inside. It’s easy. My prayer is that people will return to the word of God and spend time in the word of God, spend time with the Lord in prayer and not be effected easily. Look, I think that the Thessalonians must have not watched YouTube, but they’ve heard every little rumor that came from around the world and they were losing hope, and that’s why Paul needed to tell them do not be like those without hope and he had to remind them what the hope is.
Amir: I want to always remind people the hope that we have, the blessed hope that we have and that we cannot be like those without hope. Because the world right now, honestly, is looking at us. Is looking at us.
Todd: That’s right.
Amir: If we are having anxiety and fear, and if we are in hysteria right now, how different are we from the world? Where is that peace that surpasses all understanding that we always preach on and say that we have.
Jeff: Amen.
Amir: …and that peace will only come if we spend time with the one who is the prince of peace.
Jeff: Amen. It’s like Proverbs says, the name of the Lord is a strong tower-
Amir: Amen.
Jeff: …the righteous run into it and they’re safe.
Amir: Amen.
Jeff: Amir, that’s the word that we need right now. Listen, we just want to thank you first of all, for your kindred spirit that you are a fellow soldier in Christ Jesus and Amir, we cheer you on from across the world here, but we’re united with you in our common mission to help wake the bride of Christ to prepare her for the soon return of Jesus and also to herald the message to the world of the gospel and the good news of Christ that he is the ark of salvation and the door is still open right now. We want to thank you so much for being with us.
Amir: Thank you guys and God bless you.
Jeff: Amen.
Todd: God bless you as well, and to our listeners, we really encourage you to listen to this podcast a few times over because there was so much great information packed in there. If you want to find out more about our ministry, just go to prophecyprospodcast.com and there you can ask us questions, follow up questions. You can also find out more information about Jeff’s ministry and my ministry and of course, if you have anything further you want to know about Amir, we’d be glad to share, and we’re going to include information about his ministry so you can find out more about that as well. Thanks again for listening and tuning in again to another Prophecy Pros podcast episode.
Jeff: Hey, thank you so much for listening. We’re really excited you found us. Make sure to subscribe if you have not done so already, and if you liked what you heard, please let us know by leaving a review. That does us a huge favor and helps us out a lot. For more resources or to ask questions or find more about our ministries, go to prophecyprospodcast.com, and a major thank you, major shout out to Harvest House Publishers for helping us with this podcast.
![[S1E13 - Dr. Tony Evans A Crisis of Leadership and Hope in Prophecy.mp3]]
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Jeff: Welcome to the Prophecy Pros podcast. I’m Jeff Kinley, along with Todd Hampson and today our special guest is Dr. Tony Evans. And you obviously know who Tony is, if not, you’re about to learn. He’s the founder and senior pastor of the 10,000 member Oak Cliff Bible Fellowship in Dallas. The founder, and president of the Urban Alternative, a former chaplain of the NFL’s Dallas Cowboys, and a present chaplain at the NBA’s Dallas Mavericks. His radio broadcast, The Alternative with Dr. Tony Evans can be heard over a thousand US radio outlets every day, and in more than 130 countries. And for me personally, I’ve had the privilege of studying under Dr. Evans way back in the day at Dallas Seminary, where I had him for Evangelism and some other courses, and it was never, ever a dull moment. Dr. Evans, thank you so much for joining us. Welcome to the Prophecy Pros podcast.
Dr. Evans: Thank you. Good to be with you.
Todd: Well, Dr. Evans, you’ve written books on leadership spoken at leadership events. Actually I’ve even been to a couple of way back in the day, I’m from the DC area. So I was at a RFK event and Stand in the Gap and got to see you get your preach on and just really enjoyed that. But you’ve had some very impactful ministry organizations for many years. What wisdom can you share about leading through difficult and challenging times?
Dr. Evans: Well, difficult and challenging times show whether leadership is really there or not. A leader has to know the way, go the way, and show the way. He must be able to ascertain the reality of things, know how he should proceed, show others why they need to go in that particular direction, modeling it for them, and then leading them there. We do have a crisis of leadership today where we do not have enough leaders who are bringing God’s viewpoint to bear on life’s realities in such a way that people are following them to replicate them and the application to whatever the issue is that they are supposed to provide leadership for.
Jeff: Hmm, amen. You know, Dr. Evans, you’ve been a pastor for many decades. I’ll remember back at Dallas Seminary one of the first things you taught us was that you didn’t like dead preaching. It was one of the things you thought that a pastor needs to be passionate about what he’s talking about. And obviously you’ve done that through expositional teaching through books of the Bible, but also a wide range of topics, including eschatology, which is one of the topics we talk about on here. What is, in your opinion, the usual response, when you teach on the topic of eschatology or revelation or something like that, what’s the response you get from your congregation?
Dr. Evans: Well, it’s very interesting because we get a lot of questions because that’s a pretty big subject and people are, want to know about the future and what God is saying about the future and how it relates to them, not only in the future, but for the decisions that they need to make today. So we try to make it not only relevant for tomorrow, but impact their decision making today. And when you can blend those two together, then it becomes a relevant topic and not only a futuristic one.
Jeff: Absolutely. And along with that, just in terms of overall discipleship, philosophy of ministry, that type of thing, as you teach on these type of topics, I know it’s hard sometimes for people to see the future and how it impacts the present. What would be one way you would say that teaching about eschatology and God’s prophetic promises does change our lives in the now?
Dr. Evans: Well, when you learn about the eternal state of mankind, it should stimulate evangelism. When you learn about the judgment seat of Christ, it should stimulate obedient living. When you learn about what happens with the soul, when the soul leaves the body it ought to give you comfort. I lost my wife three months ago, four months ago and knowing that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord and what that eternal hope is, gives you comfort in your tears. So when you can connect it to your responsibility and your understanding, then it’s not pie in the sky information. It’s transformative because it’s affecting you even now.
Jeff: Hmm, amen. I think of Paul’s words in 1st Thess four, when he says at the end of teaching on the rapture, he says, “Therefore, comfort one another with these words.” And that comforting that we get from the Holy spirit and the word of God certainly is powerful. One of the questions before I put you back to Todd here, why do you think so many believers today tend to shy away from the study of eschatology, kind of avoid revelation, almost like the pandemic kind of thing. What are some ways that we can use the teaching of eschatology to present it to a new generation? And why do people tend to avoid it, you think?
Dr. Evans: I think today people are so centered on this world, their lives, their livelihoods, and we live in a very individualistic me-istic generation that that doesn’t seem relevant. Part of that is how it’s proclaimed and how it’s preached, because when it was taught in scripture, it was very relevant. So it wasn’t a pie in the sky doctrine. And so when we fail to let this next generation see that this relates to you where you are, then it will be dismissed because they’re not there now in their thinking and in the world view. I mean, when you look at technology, when you look at the media and how minds have been just infiltrated with this world’s thinking that it shouldn’t surprise us, that the world to come has faded. So what we’ve got to do is we’ve got to up the ante and make this world connected to that world.
Todd: That’s well put, and that’s a perfect lead into the next question because Jeff and I have been noticing because of COVID-19 and recent global developments, even a lot of it’s been blown out of proportion. There are just so many prophetic things linked to it. And we’ve had a lot of people that used to say, we were crazy for talking about end times, Bible prophecy, all of a sudden saying, “Hey, what does the Bible say about this?” So how does the current global instability with all the effects of COVID-19 and other perplexing wild issues that we can’t really get a grip on, how do those demonstrate a convergence of end time conditions in our day?
Dr. Evans: Well, first of all, everybody should be very aware of the fact that the world can be turned upside down on a dime. I mean, this thing happened virtually overnight and it’s affected the whole world. So when the Bible talks about things happening on a worldwide scale, you know that that can happen right now. The Bible also talks about various kinds of plagues. Well we’ve seen this plague, plague us. And we’ve seen the repercussions of that plague, so we need to take the potential of God’s judgment really serious, because who would have thought that something like this could happen this way. We see the battle with China. That’s a whole nother thing with the rise of China in the midst of this. We see how an economy can collapse almost overnight. Look at the economic stress that we’re going through and that much of the world is going through. So you can see how an antichrist could come in a situation like this and have a one world economy. So you can see whether this is the end time or not a template for how it could happen, which should make you rethink how real God’s prophetic future is because of what you’re seeing right now.
Todd: Absolutely. Yeah. If one little germ caused this much global disruption, you can only imagine what the rapture will do when that happens. And it’s funny, the more we talk about this, there’s no gray anymore. We either get people like, I see what you’re talking about. This is all in scripture. And then we get a whole nother perspective. Like you guys are crazy and you’re being sensational, which we steer away from sensationalism and that kind of thing. But for the skeptic, what are one or two key signs we could point them to right now that might even just get their attention to say, this is pretty concrete evidence. We are in the end times, or we’re nearing that time period. The tribulation is casting its shadow on us. What are one or two things who might be able to share with them?
Dr. Evans: Well, one thing that you can share with them is the worldwide scope of it, because the whole world is being affected at one level or another. So I look at the scope of it as a big deal. Not only because of how far it’s spread, but it’s affected every category of life. So all of life has been uprooted, so the two are interconnected. And so when you, when you look at how quickly it happened, how broadly it happened, how devastating it’s been, then I think you have to reconsider your prophetic orientation.
Jeff: Absolutely. It does get people’s attention. I mean, I can’t think of a time in my lifetime where the entire world has been talking about one single thing. And again, it’s, it’s affected every single person just about on the planet here. Dr. Evans in these kind of times where there’s a lot of white noise, there’s a lot of stereo, there’s a lot of height. There’s like conspiracy theories. All these things are floating around. How do we, as Christian leaders help Christians kind of distinguish or discern between hysteria, hype and hope? In other words, how do we bring them to that biblical perspective? So they can see the world clearly and not lose their sense of peace?
Dr. Evans: Well, first of all, we have to identify the source of hope. Source of hope is never tied to your circumstances, or you’d be hopeless. A lot of it is in the character and promises of God. So you have to keep going back to his character and you have to keep going back to his promises based on his word. And therein is where you get your hope. So your focus will determine your feelings of hope or hopelessness. If all you see is what you see, then you’ll never see all there is to be seen. Everything visible and physical is preceded by something invisible and spiritual. So if you want to be able to function in the visible physical, you must be able to see the invisible spiritual.
Todd: Hmm, wow. And kind of dovetailing with that you’ve kind of already hit on this a little bit, but I’m just thinking, one thing I love about your ministry is it’s always very practical. Whether when you preach or whatever resources or books you put out, it’s not so deep and so heady that you can’t apply it to real life. So how can we, through eschatology and an understanding of end time events and God’s character and future promises, if there’s somebody watching or listening to this podcast, how can we give them just a new sense of perspective or joy in the midst of all this craziness that’s going around?
Dr. Evans: Well, first of all, I would say they need to start with looking at what Jesus says about end times, because if you’re a Christian, Jesus is your centerpiece. When he was leaving in John 14, his disciples, and they were all shook up and felt hopeless because of his disappearance. He gave them hope by giving them him. And what this pandemic should do is force us to do a spiritual reset. This is the time to draw nearer, not drift further from the Lord. And when you use, God said in Acts 8, God said persecution in order to get the church out of Jerusalem and to spread the gospel. So God will use inconvenience to move you out of your comfort zone. So look at the pandemic as an inconvenient opportunity. Churchill said, “You never let a good crisis go to waste.” So don’t let this pandemic go to waste.Because you’re forced to quarantine more than you want to, because the economics may be shaky, let that drive you to pursue intimacy with the savior so that you can learn. When the Bible talks about peace of pastor’s understanding, the reason why it’s a peace of pastor’s understanding, is you don’t understand why you have it right now and later what you’re going through. So when you pursue him in the midst of the crisis and he still gives you peace in a rocky boat, that’s when you know your faith is real and vibrant and alive.
Jeff: Amen. Dr. Evans, as you think back over your life and your ministry, and you’ve logged a lot of miles. You’ve got some mileage on ministry and just impacting lives really around the world. As you think back on everything that you’ve done, you’ve taught, the new study Bible that’s come out now, your church, your family, everything, what do you want to be remembered by when people think about Tony Evans?
Dr. Evans: You know, our world view is called the kingdom agenda, which is the visible manifestation of the comprehensive rule of God over every area of life. So I want to be remembered as a person who advance God’s kingdom for God’s glory.
Jeff: amen. And giving him all the glory. And Dr. Evans, how can people find out more about your ministry?
Dr. Evans: They can go on Tonyevans.org. You can find out all of our resources, all of our programming. We have a training center now. People can learn about what this kingdom life is all about comprehensively. Tonyevans.org.
Jeff: Well, thank you again. Todd’s going to close us out, but Dr. Evans, from my heart to yours, thank you so much for your impact in my life and for your faithfulness to our Lord, Jesus Christ.
Dr. Evans: Thank you very much.
Todd: Amen. I want to echo that as well. Just even what you shared today, there’s such a wealth of information there for our listeners and us personally, that people will be listening to this episode over and over again, I’m sure. We know you’re busy, want to thank you for taking the time out to talk with us and share your heart and share some aspects of ministry. And we thank you even more for just who you are, for your family, for your ministry, what you’ve done over the years. We thank you for your impact, your kingdom impact, and it’s affected both of us in a profound way. We pray for the Lord’s continued blessing on you, your ministry, your family, and everything that you’re doing right now. We just thank you so much for being on the show.
Dr. Evans: Thank you, God bless you.
Todd: You too, brother.
Jeff: Hey, thank you so much for listening. We’re really excited you found us. Make sure to subscribe if you have not done so already. And if you liked what you heard, please let us know by leaving a review, that does us a huge favor and helps us out a lot for more resources or to ask questions or find more about our ministries, go to prophecyprospodcast.com. And a major thank you, major shout out to Harvest House Publishers for helping us with this podcast.
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